HALACHA-----shabbos/ clapping on

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basyisroel-613 Posted - 21 November 2000 15:56

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Why exactly is there an issur of clapping on Shabbos?

I remember hearing once that because it is a very mundane act (chol)it shouldn't be done in the usual manner. However, I recently heard that it's because it makes music and making music is asur on Shabbos - but if that is the case then even doing it with a shinuy / slight alteration would be asur no?

MODERATOR Posted - 21 November 2000 18:55

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The only issur of clapping on Shabbos is clapping to music, and not everyone agrees with that. There are those who hold you may clap to Zemiros.

There is no issur to applaud a speaker, or any such clapping that is not to music. Such an issur is stated nowhere. It is permitted to clap for applause on Shabbos.

Me Posted - 06 December 2000 16:52

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are you allowed to drum on the table to zmiros on shabbos???

MODERATOR Posted - 06 December 2000 16:53

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That is included in the prohibition of clapping. Whatever you hold about clapping (see my post above) would apply as well to drumming on the table.

However, that is only is you drum with your hands. Drumming with an object, such as a spoon or knife or stick, would be prohibited for sure.

emmess Posted - 06 December 2000 18:17

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Is my question going to be posted or answered?

MODERATOR Posted - 06 December 2000 18:29

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Actually, it won't be posted, because it got lost, but it will be answered.

You asked that from rashi in Beitzah 30a it seems that the prohibition of clapping applies even without singing, since he says that they used to clap for mourning, which is not singing.

Sorry we lost your post. Here's the answer:

The Gemora on 36b says that the reason for the prohibition of clapping is because people may set up a musical instrument to accompany the clapping with music, and that is prohibited. The Kaf HaChaim (339:9) brings the reason they would want to have musical instruments to accompany the clapping:

"To sing or to mourn".

In other words, they used to mourn with playing musical instruments. The clapping, therefore, that Rashi mentions is clapping to this sad music.

Then there is the Aruch HaShulchan (339) who claims that the entire prohibition does not apply nowadays because in the times of Chazal all clapping was done with musical accompaniment and that's why we are scared of making the instruments.

Even if we are not going to accept the distinction between nowadays and then - many poskim don't - clearly the Aruch HaShulchan understood that only clapping to music was prohibited.

Also, although Rashi on 30a does make the ambiguous statement that you mention, Rashi on the Mishna 36b says that the clapping that the Mishna prohibits was associated with song.

Me Posted - 25 December 2000 21:24

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Wait I didn't chap what you said about drumming on the shabbos table to zmiros with my hands and about clapping. would I be allowed too?

MODERATOR Posted - 25 December 2000 21:46

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It is a Machlokes. Some permit and some prohibit. Some permit with a "shinui", meaning, you can only clap backhanded, (instead of using both your palms, you use one palm and one top of your hand. It's like the motions people sometimes make when they say "well??? where were you???", where they slap the top of one hand into the palm of the other.)