MISC-----kabbalists and palm readers 2
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Rachack Posted - 01 February 2004 15:37
What about Rav Yonason Eybishitz (I totally misspelled the last name) didn’t he make like charms and stuff like that for people? (And yes I know that many ppl disagreed with him, but still he is looked at as a great Rav nowadays)
MODERATOR Posted - 06 February 2004 12:33
Rav Yonason Eyebushitz was indeed a great Godol, and was subject to the false and baseless accusation of his being a Shabse Tzvi-nik. But nobody B"H takes those misinformed accusations seriously (except some sensationalist maskilim who have nothing better to do with their life than trying to "out" Gedolim as being closet heretics. Sigh.)
Of course there is such a thing as Kameios (its in the Gemora and Shulchan Aruch and poskim), and Brachos, but they come from great Tzadikim like Rav Yonason Eyebushitz ZTL, not witch doctor women or amei haaretz or spiritual mediocrities.
Even regarding a prophet, the Rambam says that only someone who is established beforehand to be a tzadik and yorei shamayim to the Nth degree is acceptable as a Navi; if someone who is not a Torah Jew of great accomplishment professes to be a Navi, we know he is a faker or witch doctor or tumah user, and the rambam says this is true even if he indeed makes some miracles.
The Satmar Rebbe ZTL who was probably the greatest maven on these things in our times, was once asked about these Kabalah people who aren’t exceptional in the Yiras Shamayim - Talmidei Chachamim but claim to "see" things. This was his answer:
The Gemora says that before a baby is born, a malach comes and shows him the entire world form one end to the other, and teaches him the whole torah. Then when he is born he forgets the Torah.
Question: The Gemroa says that he forgets the Torah, but it doesn’t say that he forgets his vision of the entire world. So why, when a baby is born, does he not know what the whole world looks like from end to end?
Answer: Once he forgets his Torah, he no longer can see the world. Because without Torah, you cant see a thing.
In other words, Rav Yonason Eyebushitz is reliable; the GRA is reliable; the Chazon Ish is reliable. They have Torah. These others are useless to us.
MODERATOR Posted - 14 May 2006 18:50
Tamim Tihiyah (Devarim 18:13) is a Mitzvah that tells us not to care what fortune tellers or other future-seers say, because we know that Hashem is in charge of the world, and He can change whatever those people see in whatever they are looking at anyway, so who cares what they say.
And we should not have an interest in these peeks into the future, even if it is done in a way that is permitted according to the Torah (i.e. even if it is not kishef etc).
In other words, we should not have anything to do with any of those people who tell the future in any way whatsoever.
We also have no interest in looking into the future in any way whatsoever. Rather, we trust in Hashem that whatever He wants will happen, and that what happens is dependent on our ACTIONS, not something that these people see in our palms or the stars or our names or whatever.
All these types of people are either fakers - which is most of the time, the vast, vast majority - or utilizing some forces of tumah.
I would suggest that you get a hold of a wonderful work on this topic, by the Mekubal and Talmid Chacham Rav Yaakov Moshe Hillel, called Kuntres Tamim Tihiyeh, which is an excerpt form his Teshuvos Vayashav HaYam #16.
After a very thorough treatment of the subject, he points out that in order to be on the level to know the future in gashmiyus things, such as those which these witch-doctors and pseudo-kabalah people claim to know, in any form whatsoever - unless you’re using kochos hatumah - you have to be on the level of the great neviim.
He quotes from the Tanya (Igros Kodesh 22) that even the great sages of Chazal who were baalei ruach hakodesh and knew the "streets of the heavens" as well as the streets of the earth, you still could not ask them the future - only the great prophets like Shmuel had that ability.
And even to be on the level of e Baal Ruach HaKodesh of our times, you still have to be on an awesome level of righteousness (he quotes criteria from the Arizal), including learning Torah lishmah until he has no strength left, and much, much more than that.
On the contrary, he writes, such soothsayers and miracle-makers were never respected in Klall Yisroel amongst the Gedolim, but rather they were looked down upon, and were the objects of scorn, since obviously they were not on the level to make those miracles in a Kosher way. When the Gedolim found our about such a person, they would prohibit people to go to see him.
If you want to get a Brachah from someone, he says, go to the known and established Gedolim and Tzadikim, the rabbanim and poskim, the spreaders of Torah, those whose righteousness is known to all.
That having been said, it is known that certain women - and this means only certain ones, not every one who claims to be - do have a Mesorah about dealing with ayin horah. I know that recently Rav Elyashev sent someone to one of these women.
I also heard that Rav Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld's wife used to be into this, too. However, all this means is that if Rav Elyashev or someone else like him endorses one of these women, you can rely on him. There are many, many fakers out there. And tumah-users.
satinsword13 Posted - 10 September 2006 19:31
Mod, for YEARS, I thought you could ask Hashem for signs, and then a rebbi of mine told me it's not true. so please can you answer mine and unlively's question about if you can ask Hashem for signs?
Also, what about mekubalim who don’t tell the future-but they seem to know a lot about you and your life, and they give you stuff to say, and tell you what to do based on how they see who you are automatically. I go to one every so often, what do we hold about them- not future tellers, but stam mekubalim?
MODERATOR Posted - 10 September 2006 19:34
They tell you what to do? What do you mean what to do? Doesn’t the Torah already tell us what to do?
Answer this question for me please: Does your Kabbalah guy know how to learn? And if so how well?
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